di[lomay needs more

[protomatter]

some settings are required for the diplomat program.

1) kill targets
2) agressive/retreat switch

[KlingonKommand]

I can't set Kill targets in a script. Partly because you don't know what
the object ID's will be, partly because there just isn't such a script
command. It's on Rick's list of "one day" to-do's.

Aggressive/Retreat are in the latest Diplomat though. Aggressive is in
the bottom right corner area - one of the "less common orders" - ie, I
figured you rarely change it from On. Retreat is about 2 inches above
it, one of the "Movement" commands.

No hang on - this means you're doing sims figuring how to kill me in
Weekend Warrior - forget everything I said.

Post by protomatter
some settings are required for the diplomat program.
1) kill targets
2) agressive/retreat switch

[protomatter]

Post by KlingonKommand
I can't set Kill targets in a script. Partly because you don't know what
the object ID's will be, partly because there just isn't such a script
command. It's on Rick's list of "one day" to-do's.
Aggressive/Retreat are in the latest Diplomat though. Aggressive is in
the bottom right corner area - one of the "less common orders" - ie, I
figured you rarely change it from On. Retreat is about 2 inches above
it, one of the "Movement" commands.

ok i see it now, i also notice the sandcaster options are different,
in the game you can turn off all sandcaster options, i dont know how
different this is from what diplomat does however,

what im trying to simulate is something one of my enemies has been
doing, he has everything off except cloak in orbit of his himeworld. i
cant attack his ships as he seems to be rotating them from different
planets to clear the locations and ids to keep me guessing. when i
head to his homeworld with options not to attack his base. nothing
occurs, no combat takes place. but when i set my ship to attack his
homeworld, some 30+ cloaked deth specs and 10 or so darkwings attack
and destroy my fleet without repercussions. because my fleet is
focused on the planet and wont fire on the ships, this focus (on the
planet is the only thing that will allow me to get him to decloak, but
as a result i cant fire on his shipsdue to the target being the base.
very frustrating and im unable to get the diplomat to simulate this
properly.

Post by KlingonKommand
No hang on - this means you're doing sims figuring how to kill me in
Weekend Warrior - forget everything I said.

not likely, this is an entirely nother game where im having the
problem. also this perticular game seems to have ground assault
problems still... all m,y other games seem to be working for ground
assaults including weekend warrior but the game " 4-man crosshairs"
seem to have dropped its ability to ground combat altogether.

Proto

[Gabor Törö]

Post by protomatter
what im trying to simulate is something one of my enemies has been
doing, he has everything off except cloak in orbit of his himeworld. i
cant attack his ships as he seems to be rotating them from different
planets to clear the locations and ids to keep me guessing. when i
head to his homeworld with options not to attack his base. nothing
occurs, no combat takes place. but when i set my ship to attack his
homeworld, some 30+ cloaked deth specs and 10 or so darkwings attack
and destroy my fleet without repercussions. because my fleet is
focused on the planet and wont fire on the ships, this focus (on the
planet is the only thing that will allow me to get him to decloak, but
as a result i cant fire on his shipsdue to the target being the base.
very frustrating and im unable to get the diplomat to simulate this
properly.

IIRC then if cloakers are set to guard base then they follow the base into
combat.
IIRC then you will attack a base even with ground attack = off. Just do not
use avoid base.
Your ships then should battle the cloakers and at least if they
aredestroyedyour ships should continue to attack the base.

Gabor

[protomatter]

Post by Gabor Törö
IIRC then if cloakers are set to guard base then they follow the base into
combat.
IIRC then you will attack a base even with ground attack = off. Just do not
use avoid base.
Your ships then should battle the cloakers and at least if they
aredestroyedyour ships should continue to attack the base.
Gabor

i didnt know we could attack ground bases with ground attack off.

are you sure?

Proto

[Gabor Törö]

Post by protomatter

Post by Gabor Törö
IIRC then if cloakers are set to guard base then they follow the base into
combat.
IIRC then you will attack a base even with ground attack = off. Just do not
use avoid base.
Your ships then should battle the cloakers and at least if they
aredestroyedyour ships should continue to attack the base.
Gabor

i didnt know we could attack ground bases with ground attack off.
are you sure?

If Sebastian has put in this code, yes. We had an agreement about this that
bases are attacked by default. Avoid base should exclude them and "ground
attack" should make them more primary target no.1 and let the objects forget
stand off settings.

Gabor

BTW:

New: When a wing or ship is set to guard base and there is a base owned by
that same player in range of the combat initiation, it will be pulled into
combat if it has fighters, ion cannons or AAGs to add support to the combat.
This will happen for ships even if they are hidden from other players. It
will also happen if ships/wings have their aggressive mode disabled.

But not sure if "hidden" also refers to cloaked units.

[protomatter]

Post by Gabor Törö

Post by protomatter

Post by Gabor Törö
IIRC then if cloakers are set to guard base then they follow the base into
combat.
IIRC then you will attack a base even with ground attack = off. Just do not
use avoid base.
Your ships then should battle the cloakers and at least if they
aredestroyedyour ships should continue to attack the base.
Gabor

i didnt know we could attack ground bases with ground attack off.
are you sure?

If Sebastian has put in this code, yes. We had an agreement about this that
bases are attacked by default. Avoid base should exclude them and "ground
attack" should make them more primary target no.1 and let the objects forget
stand off settings.
Gabor
New: When a wing or ship is set to guard base and there is a base owned by
that same player in range of the combat initiation, it will be pulled into
combat if it has fighters, ion cannons or AAGs to add support to the combat.
This will happen for ships even if they are hidden from other players. It
will also happen if ships/wings have their aggressive mode disabled.
But not sure if "hidden" also refers to cloaked units.

not sure about the meaning of hidden, but ive also heard other report
that combat will pull cloakers off the standard" survalence " and into
combat. in my case the bases being attacked pulls them into combat.

Proto

[GFM GToeroe]

Post by protomatter

Post by Gabor Törö

Post by protomatter

Post by Gabor Törö
IIRC then if cloakers are set to guard base then they follow the base into
combat.
IIRC then you will attack a base even with ground attack = off. Just do not
use avoid base.
Your ships then should battle the cloakers and at least if they
aredestroyedyour ships should continue to attack the base.
Gabor

i didnt know we could attack ground bases with ground attack off.
are you sure?

If Sebastian has put in this code, yes. We had an agreement about this that
bases are attacked by default. Avoid base should exclude them and "ground
attack" should make them more primary target no.1 and let the objects forget
stand off settings.
Gabor
New: When a wing or ship is set to guard base and there is a base owned by
that same player in range of the combat initiation, it will be pulled into
combat if it has fighters, ion cannons or AAGs to add support to the combat.
This will happen for ships even if they are hidden from other players. It
will also happen if ships/wings have their aggressive mode disabled.
But not sure if "hidden" also refers to cloaked units.

not sure about the meaning of hidden, but ive also heard other report
that combat will pull cloakers off the standard" survalence " and into
combat. in my case the bases being attacked pulls them into combat.
Proto

And now your earlier comments about orbital defense and base defense
turns back as a boomerang and kicks you in the... ;P

I took your earlier comments seriously and put them into the code and
Magik extended them to combat triggering.

Satisfied?

Gabor

[protomatter]

Post by GFM GToeroe

Post by protomatter

Post by Gabor Törö

Post by protomatter

Post by Gabor Törö
IIRC then if cloakers are set to guard base then they follow the base into
combat.
IIRC then you will attack a base even with ground attack = off. Just do not
use avoid base.
Your ships then should battle the cloakers and at least if they
aredestroyedyour ships should continue to attack the base.
Gabor

i didnt know we could attack ground bases with ground attack off.
are you sure?

If Sebastian has put in this code, yes. We had an agreement about this that
bases are attacked by default. Avoid base should exclude them and "ground
attack" should make them more primary target no.1 and let the objects forget
stand off settings.
Gabor
New: When a wing or ship is set to guard base and there is a base owned by
that same player in range of the combat initiation, it will be pulled into
combat if it has fighters, ion cannons or AAGs to add support to the combat.
This will happen for ships even if they are hidden from other players. It
will also happen if ships/wings have their aggressive mode disabled.
But not sure if "hidden" also refers to cloaked units.

not sure about the meaning of hidden, but ive also heard other report
that combat will pull cloakers off the standard" survalence " and into
combat. in my case the bases being attacked pulls them into combat.
Proto

And now your earlier comments about orbital defense and base defense
turns back as a boomerang and kicks you in the... ;P
I took your earlier comments seriously and put them into the code and
Magik extended them to combat triggering.
Satisfied?
Gabor

if its attack on bases is defaulted, then this should sufficently
solve the problem. ill test it out next turn.
thanks guys
Proto

[Sebastian]

Post by Gabor Törö
If Sebastian has put in this code, yes. We had an agreement about this
that bases are attacked by default. Avoid base should exclude them and
"ground attack" should make them more primary target no.1 and let the
objects forget stand off settings.

Of cause I put that code in. I also told Protocantread that the switch
"Attack ground bases" should be renamed to "Bases First".

But once again: Bases are attacked by default. Only Avoid bases keeps
you from firing at bases. But beware if you avoid bases and the defender
has Base Guards you get a penalty and the defender gets and advantage to
the weapon accuracies.

Proto I'm still waiting for you bug reports with the base not being
targeted when you pull "Small first".

Sebastian ;P

[protomatter]

Post by Sebastian

Post by Gabor Törö
If Sebastian has put in this code, yes. We had an agreement about this
that bases are attacked by default. Avoid base should exclude them and
"ground attack" should make them more primary target no.1 and let the
objects forget stand off settings.

Of cause I put that code in. I also told Protocantread that the switch
"Attack ground bases" should be renamed to "Bases First".
But once again: Bases are attacked by default. Only Avoid bases keeps
you from firing at bases. But beware if you avoid bases and the defender
has Base Guards you get a penalty and the defender gets and advantage to
the weapon accuracies.
Proto I'm still waiting for you bug reports with the base not being
targeted when you pull "Small first".
Sebastian ;P

well that clears alot of things up, ill get with those sims. but i
cant reproduce the sim environment of the game environments(diplomat
has no kill target setting). so at this point im kinda stymied, but
that last post of yours might be the difference. previously we were
told that in order to get a base into the VCR was to specify it as the
kill target and set bases firstt. when doing this the ships were hit
in the back. by the base gaurds. kill target is not an option of
diplomat. thus the simulations were invalid. but now ive noticed ,
possibly due to bug fixes that kill target for bases is no longer
needed. and that bases first is no longer needed and now im getting
the desired results. so thanks for the aid in clarifying the bases
first switch (should be renamed i agree as i was a veteran who was
confused, imagine a novice trying to understand)).

Protocantsim

[Gabor Törö]

Post by protomatter
some settings are required for the diplomat program.
1) kill targets

Now targets can currently be scripted. I have made suggestions to Rick to
implement this.

Post by protomatter
2) agressive/retreat switch

Is there for ships. A wing needs a "agressive" switch and a way to switch
off "strike thru" and "close to point blank".

Gaobr

[Gabor Törö]

Of course, I meant "no targets".

Post by Gabor Törö

Post by protomatter
some settings are required for the diplomat program.
1) kill targets

Now targets can currently be scripted. I have made suggestions to Rick to
implement this.

Post by protomatter
2) agressive/retreat switch

Is there for ships. A wing needs a "agressive" switch and a way to switch
off "strike thru" and "close to point blank".
Gaobr