Discussion:
Lower income from labor mines?
(too old to reply)
Phaidros
2008-05-16 08:58:10 UTC
Permalink
Have the host 213 changes led to a general drop of income from labor
mines?

I get 50% of what I should get from the rule of 3 mc per labor mine
and mineral. Minerals to be mined are there.

Phaidros
Lord Owl
2008-05-16 10:14:51 UTC
Permalink
One limited is the actual amount of minerals you are mining. Your race
mining ability comes into play here. If 100 labormines are only
sufficient to mine, say, 50 metals, you'll get 50*3 mc instead of
100*3. A surplus of metals in the ground isn't of advantage here (in a
single turn perspective), since income is determined by what you're
actually mining.
Lord Lancelot
2008-05-16 10:34:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lord Owl
One limited is the actual amount of minerals you are mining. Your race
mining ability comes into play here. If 100 labormines are only
sufficient to mine, say, 50 metals, you'll get 50*3 mc instead of
100*3. A surplus of metals in the ground isn't of advantage here (in a
single turn perspective), since income is determined by what you're
actually mining.
This mean Aczanny only get 35% ?
This seem too low for them (, and perhaps also for the bird).

Mining rates of race with Labor Mines
Aczanny 35
Birdmen 70
Drac 110
Stormer 120

How about using the mining rates of the prisoners you are holding.
Would add some value to hunting specific races, Lizard would give you
190, but good luck ground attacking them.
The lazy Priv mine at 25, the master miners are the IMT with 200.

This would let the Aczanny with a better income if they manage to get
any race beside the Solorian and priv.

P.S.
This would give the Solorian a new immunity since they have 0 mining
rate, they do not need it, they could mine at your own race rating
when in your labor mines.

Lord Lancelot
Lord Lancelot
2008-05-16 10:51:12 UTC
Permalink
I just found out: Labor Mines will use the mining rate of the
prisoner's race instead of your own. It is still only half as
effective at mining as standard Mineral Mines. Prisoners will die
after they mine instead of before. (Host 212e)

Wiki has been updated.
http://planets4.hood-net.org/wiki/index.php/Labor_Mine

* Cyborg prisoners will not work in labor mines.
* Robots prisoners work in labor mines, but not labor camps.
* Solorian have 0 mining rates they will not work in Labor mines.
Phaidros
2008-05-16 11:35:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lord Lancelot
I just found out: Labor Mines will use the mining rate of the
prisoner's race instead of your own. It is still only half as
effective at mining as standard Mineral Mines. Prisoners will die
after they mine instead of before. (Host 212e)
I interpreted that to mean that the mining rate of the prisoner race
determines to amount of minerals you get but not the amount of money.

The numbers from the game also won't go together with that
interpretation. I have Privateer Prisoners who have a mining rate of
25. MC output from the labor mines is double the output from the labor
camps. If the mining rate were used it should be exactly the same
amount of money.

Phaidros
Phaidros
2008-05-30 20:19:00 UTC
Permalink
My observation still applies. The labor mine code seems to check not
only whether there are unmined minerals (I have lots of all four
types), but also whether there is ore of all four types around (in my
case only for two types). The missing ore reduces the income from the
labor mines.

Is that intended?

Phaidros
Lord Lancelot
2008-05-30 21:33:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Phaidros
My observation still applies. The labor mine code seems to check not
only whether there are unmined minerals (I have lots of all four
types), but also whether there is ore of all four types around (in my
case only for two types). The missing ore reduces the income from the
labor mines.
Is that intended?
Phaidros
Yes mining all 4 ore12mc, you miss 3mc per ore type missing. Intended.

Now what I think is happening.

The amount of metal extracted is not relevant for the income. LM
produce.
The mining rate is the one from the race working in your LM.
Phaidros
2008-05-31 21:47:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lord Lancelot
Yes mining all 4 ore12mc, you miss 3mc per ore type missing. Intended.
That's very counter-intuitive. Labor mines don't produce ore like
normal mines do. Instead they transform only unmined minerals into
metals. Yet they care about whether ore is lying around or not.

Phaidros
Magik
2008-05-31 22:58:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Phaidros
Post by Lord Lancelot
Yes mining all 4 ore12mc, you miss 3mc per ore type missing. Intended.
That's very counter-intuitive. Labor mines don't produce ore like
normal mines do. Instead they transform only unmined minerals into
metals. Yet they care about whether ore is lying around or not.
Phaidros
People confuse the wording of ore, minerals, and unmined all the
time. In this case, if an unmined mineral is not present then you
won't ge the 3mc income for that. In addition, the amount of cash
generated is based on how much unmined minerals that you mines as
metals. For example, if you have 1000 Labor Mines and enough
prisoners to use them all then you have the potential of producing
3000 mc from one mineral type if you happen to mine out 1000 kt of
metals of that type of mineral. If you only mine out 432kt then
you'll only get 1296mc.

Magik
Phaidros
2008-06-01 08:54:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Magik
Post by Phaidros
Post by Lord Lancelot
Yes mining all 4 ore12mc, you miss 3mc per ore type missing. Intended.
That's very counter-intuitive. Labor mines don't produce ore like
normal mines do. Instead they transform only unmined minerals into
metals. Yet they care about whether ore is lying around or not.
Phaidros
People confuse the wording of ore, minerals, and unmined all the
time. In this case, if an unmined mineral is not present then you
won't ge the 3mc income for that. In addition, the amount of cash
generated is based on how much unmined minerals that you mines as
metals. For example, if you have 1000 Labor Mines and enough
prisoners to use them all then you have the potential of producing
3000 mc from one mineral type if you happen to mine out 1000 kt of
metals of that type of mineral. If you only mine out 432kt then
you'll only get 1296mc.
Magik
I begin to understand the new rule, but I think nobody noticed the
drastic reduction in income from labor mines that comes with it.

The sum of the mineral DENSITIES of all 4 mineral types is now the new
additional key factor determining the income from labor mines. Before
the new rule income was 3mc x 4 x 100% of the number of working labor
mines x3.

Now in this specific example:
Density
N 62
Tri 40
Dur 19
Moly 49
Sum of densities: 163

With 100 labor mines and unmined minerals of all types present I got
100 x 4 x 3 mc = 1200 mc.
Comparing that same planet with the same densities and the same amount
of unmined minerals present, income from labor mines is now less than
half of the maximum of what was possible before.

The effects of the new rule don't end here.
As the income from labor mines depends on the number of METALS
EXTRACTED, the second factor involved is the AMOUNT of unmined
minerals.

That means the income of prisoner races varies with the mineral levels
setting of a game. In low minerals games prisoner races should think
twice about taking part as they won't earn anything significant from
labor mines no matter how successful they are in enslaving their
neighbours. The 3 mc per labor factory will then be their main income.

Prisoner races now should go out on their scouting tours with a
calculator and decide based on the amount of unmined minerals in
combination with the mineral densities whether it's worth setting up a
labor mines prison planet there or not. The optimal planet would be
one with 100K of a specific mineral x a 100% mineral density for that
mineral.

Now that is an interesting innovation that I don't criticize in
principle as it introduces a new factor of location importance (which
I appreciate) into the game for the prisoners races. Conquering and
defending an optimal prison planet adds strategic spice. However it is
also an additional burden for the prisoner races that has to be
acknowledged.

(Prison planets with labor factories are still location-independent,
but in the past they generated only a quarter of the income from labor
mines.)

Therefore I think the reduction in income that came with the new rule
is too large and I'd set a higher price of 5 mc per metal extraced
through labor mines or perhaps even better make the price per metal
extraced dependent on the mineral levels setting of a game.

Phaidros
Lord Owl
2008-06-02 08:59:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Phaidros
I begin to understand the new rule, but I think nobody noticed the
drastic reduction in income from labor mines that comes with it.
You're joking, aren't you ;)? Of course we noticed!

But labormines are a difficult thing. The straight 12mc per labormine
thing was way too much income! Actually, I think they're fine now. On
the average planet they bring in only a low income. On metal rich (and
dense) planets you can go wild, at least until they're mined out,
getting lots and lots of money. I podded my prisoners through my
empire when I last had labormines, stripmining and devastating my
planets much like with swarms of locusts. It's a nice if
micromanagment heavy source of income. It's not steady though. For
this you need labor camps.

That's only a real problem for races which have labormines, but no
laborcamps. Well, meaning the Aczanny. When their planets are mined
out, that was it for their prisoners. One of the several reasons the
Aczanny are broken now.
Phaidros
2008-06-02 10:00:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lord Owl
Post by Phaidros
I begin to understand the new rule, but I think nobody noticed the
drastic reduction in income from labor mines that comes with it.
You're joking, aren't you ;)? Of course we noticed!
But labormines are a difficult thing. The straight 12mc per labormine
thing was way too much income!
Maybe for some prisoners races, but definitely not for the Draconians
and probably also not for the Azcanny.

Actually, I think they're fine now. On
Post by Lord Owl
the average planet they bring in only a low income. On metal rich (and
dense) planets you can go wild, at least until they're mined out,
getting lots and lots of money. I podded my prisoners through my
empire when I last had labormines, stripmining and devastating my
planets much like with swarms of locusts. It's a nice if
micromanagment heavy source of income. It's not steady though. For
this you need labor camps.
The stripmining technique you mention is now a like a golden dream of
the past. You're completely dependent on having that single good
minable planet in the territory that you control. If you don't happen
to have one: Bad luck, son! Game over.
Post by Lord Owl
That's only a real problem for races which have labormines, but no
laborcamps. Well, meaning the Aczanny. When their planets are mined
out, that was it for their prisoners. One of the several reasons the
Aczanny are broken now.
I consider the Draconians broken now, too, and will apply for Chapter
11 under the Galactic Rules of Conduct meaning that aggressive acts
against them are forbidden, because a honorable warrior doesn't take
the last pennies from a poor man's hut.

I'll also agitate for a Socialist Revolution in Planets4 through which
a Galactic surcharge tax of 5 percent of all incomes generated will be
levied on the three races with the highest per turn income and that
will be re-distributed via the Galactic bank to the three races
playing with the lowest per turn income. That mechanism should be in
place until the field of contenders reduces down to the last 6
players.

Phaidros
Magik
2008-06-02 15:00:58 UTC
Permalink
The densities have always been a factor. That hasn't changed. The
only changes are the limit of income from the LMs based on how much
metals were extracted and the prisoners mining rate. We cannot have
10k LMs get full income from extracting 1kt of metal...30k mc from 1kt
of metal...no.

Labor mines still generate more income than labor camps in most
situations since they only need 1 unmined mineral to be present to
match the income.

Any races with SWD or SWA can have infinite metals. If you don't have
one then trade.

Magik
Ashtar
2008-06-02 17:22:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Magik
The densities have always been a factor. That hasn't changed. The
only changes are the limit of income from the LMs based on how much
metals were extracted and the prisoners mining rate. We cannot have
10k LMs get full income from extracting 1kt of metal...30k mc from 1kt
of metal...no.
Labor mines still generate more income than labor camps in most
situations since they only need 1 unmined mineral to be present to
match the income.
Any races with SWD or SWA can have infinite metals. If you don't have
one then trade.
Magik
Not really directly tied to labor camp and mine but you might also
check for the lizard prisonners. In one turn they get around 30k with
1 million prisonner, no structure involved. Their prisoner income
rules should be blanced with your above changes in my opinion.
Magik
2008-06-02 19:59:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ashtar
Not really directly tied to labor camp and mine but you might also
check for the lizard prisonners. In one turn they get around 30k with
1 million prisonner, no structure involved. Their prisoner income
rules should be blanced with your above changes in my opinion.
1 million colonists prisoners owned by a Lizard player will sell 5%
of them, which is 50k prisoners. They go for 2.2 mc x .3 bad blood
(for most races) = 33kmc. Yes, that's quite a bit. I think that Tim
meant the default bad blood modifier to be .03 and not .3 since the
other bad bloods for Cyborg is .05, Robot is .02, and EE is .04. .03
would fall more in line. Thanks for bringing that up.

Magik
Lord Lancelot
2008-06-02 23:00:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Magik
Post by Ashtar
Not really directly tied to labor camp and mine but you might also
check for the lizard prisonners. In one turn they get around 30k with
1 million prisonner, no structure involved. Their prisoner income
rules should be blanced with your above changes in my opinion.
1 million colonists prisoners owned by a Lizard player will sell 5%
of them, which is 50k prisoners. They go for 2.2 mc x .3 bad blood
(for most races) = 33kmc. Yes, that's quite a bit. I think that Tim
meant the default bad blood modifier to be .03 and not .3 since the
other bad bloods for Cyborg is .05, Robot is .02, and EE is .04. .03
would fall more in line. Thanks for bringing that up.
Magik
While I agree that the Lizard selling of prisoners currently get too
much money too fast, at zero expense, and no time to setup structure.
And the T-Rex does not cost much, and his extremly effective both on
the map (travel) and in the VCR.
But dividing by 10 their income is too much. 3.3K a turn for 1Million
is too low. Divide by 2 there current income and they would compare to
other prisoner races.
Phaidros
2008-06-02 19:05:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Magik
The densities have always been a factor. That hasn't changed. The
only changes are the limit of income from the LMs based on how much
metals were extracted and the prisoners mining rate. We cannot have
10k LMs get full income from extracting 1kt of metal...30k mc from 1kt
of metal...no.
Labor mines still generate more income than labor camps in most
situations since they only need 1 unmined mineral to be present to
match the income.
Any races with SWD or SWA can have infinite metals. If you don't have
one then trade.
Magik
I politely disagree, but the more I consider the havoc this rule
change has done to the Dracs the more agitated I get. So wait I
moment ... I have re-booted my emotion chip and this should take me
safely through the next minutes.

Before you had to have a single unit of a mineral type mined and you
got the full 3 mc per labor mine. The density was a very minor factor
because already with a small number of labor mines it was practically
guaranteed that you would extract one unit, no matter how low the
density. The scenario you paint did not apply. 10k labor mines
extracted much more minerals that just 1 kt, in fact they rapidly
depleted the stock of unmined minerals. Well, the situation was the
reverse of now. Unless you were not in urgent need of a type of
mineral a very low density worked in your favour because it took more
turns to deplete the planet's stock.

Now to the really important stuff:
The reform has lowered the income of Dracs that they can make through
good playing by more than 50%. That is a very big blow to a race that
has always been considered to be on the economically weak side
compared with other races.

The Evil Empire in contrast retained a bonus of 10 mc per labor
factory. That's quite a reduction from the 4x income they had before,
but they weren't as economically troubled as the Dracs are to begin
with. Where do the Evil Empire players earn their money with the labor
factories? At their homeworld right in the middle of their empire, at
their shipyard, protected by distance and easy re-supply of defensive
forces.

What did it do the Dracs? It gave them a weak money-earning mechanism
that is coupled with a logistic nightmare, something the Dracs know
already from the income derived from the government centers. If you
don't believe in the force of logistics, ask the Evil Empire whether
they would like to move the 10 mc bonus to the labor mines instead of
the labor factories. Think of the hyperjumpers burning their fuel to
get the money back to their shipyard. Distance is not a problem for
them per se. It's the constant moving back and forth to get the
resources to where they are useful.

In my current game I have less than 100 minerals newly generated per
turn through high stress. Raising it to a stress level of 900 stress
would probably give 200-300. And my shipyard should live of that
money? Only 20% of the earnable money from prisoners can be directly
generated at your homeworld through the labor factories. The rest has
to be earned out there - a long way from home in a dangerous world.

Stripmining under the earlier rule was somewhat of a compromise
considered from the point of views of logistics and safety. You
established a prison center, secured it, did fast-track mining that
yielded an amount of money that was big enough to warrant a transport
by ship to a shipyard and quickly moved on to the next planet. In the
face of danger you were flexible enough to retreat and choose another
planet.

Now you have to hunker down at the best planet you can find for mining
and any decent player knows he can swipe you off the game with a
single successful raid on that base. The remaining small trickles of
money that will continue to come in from the other suboptimal planets
and the government centers pose no threat.

Unless the Dracs are compensated I will continue to agitate for a
Socialist Revolution that takes from the rich and gives to the poor.

Phaidros
Lord Owl
2008-06-03 08:17:18 UTC
Permalink
The Dracs suck (even if some players think they're ok). That's nothing
new. Don't push for changes for labormines as long as you don't
consider their effect on the Birds and the Stormers, too. If you want
to push the Dracs, get Tim or Magik to do it. Don't necessarily insist
on pushing labormines.
Phaidros
2008-06-03 09:21:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lord Owl
The Dracs suck (even if some players think they're ok). That's nothing
new. Don't push for changes for labormines as long as you don't
consider their effect on the Birds and the Stormers, too. If you want
to push the Dracs, get Tim or Magik to do it. Don't necessarily insist
on pushing labormines.
I disagree. They are fun to play if they have the resources to put up
a mixed fleet.

The reform of the labor mines income is over the top. If the maximum
amount of money that can be earned through labor mines per turn is the
issue, it should be dealt with head on - by installing a maximum cap.

How often do you happen to succeed in a raid that gives you 1 million
prisoners? Most of the time you get away with a raid on a small or
medium-sized base. Before the reform it allowed you to gain at least
some money in a reasonable time frame instead of being condemned to
slow death by economic starvation until your neighbour delivers the
coup de grace.

If you want alternative proposals: OK
* Cut the costs for all types of Drac fighters by 50 percent. With the
new battle engine they're worth even less.
* Give them a temporary baseshield for free on any base that has 1000
labor mines filled with prisoners. As soon as the number of prisoners
drops below 100.000 the baseshield vanishes.

Phaidros

Phaidros
Lord Lancelot
2008-06-03 18:59:11 UTC
Permalink
I find the income from LM to be ok now, before it was way too much.
Most race have both LC and LM, with both structure and only one metal
to mine you still make 6mc per 100 prisoner. the first few turn with
LM you will earn 15mc per turn (you also have LC). than it will drop
to one or 2 metal.

Just built base with 100-1000 labor mines (and the matching numbers in
labor camp).

And for the Drac they have a very good early economy with their GC,
that can exceed or at the very least match other races economy until
you get first prisoners batch between turn 10-20.
Having 11 GC early is not hard, and the cost of the Drac ship list is
low you start with enough engines (on your starting ships, + the one
on the base) to have a powerful attack fleet early (towing each
other).
You gan have PTT early with the Drac if you wish too, and you have a
good HW defense ship, that can also be on the attack if needed, be
sending it at warp 50, or refiting it's engine.

The drac have a better economy than EE, Bird, Strormers, Aczanny
(prisoners races) before they get their prisoners.
So the Drac if properply played can mount a more powerful fleet, and
get prisoner earlier than those race, with the EE exception due to
their fast HYP.
Also Drac have low cost and very effective war ships the Eridanus. The
Mighty and numerous CerberusS will make short work of any enemies
minefield.
The combo Balka towing an Eridanus is cheap, they do well with PTT,
but could use lower tech weapon for their first raid to get prisoners.

I have played the Drac and find it easy to mount a early attack fleet
and get prisoners.
My Early attack fleet of the Drac is more powerful than my attack
fleet of the EE, (of witch I have played many times and won most).

Lord Lancelot
Phaidros
2008-06-03 20:22:39 UTC
Permalink
Could you please list the code that determines how unmined minerals
turn into metals with the labor mines.
From what is in the wiki for mines I have put together the following
factors but the function doesn't fit with the game data.

ExtractedMetal = (Density / 100) * (Prisoner Race Mine Modifier / 100)
* Labor Mines * 5

Phaidros
Phaidros
2008-06-03 21:11:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Phaidros
Could you please list the code that determines how unmined minerals
turn into metals with the labor mines.
From what is in the wiki for mines I have put together the following
factors but the function doesn't fit with the game data.
ExtractedMetal = (Density / 100) * (Prisoner Race Mine Modifier / 100)
* Labor Mines * 5
Phaidros
Well, one factor is missing for sure: the amount of unmined minerals.

ExtractedMetal = UnminedMinerals * (Density / 100) * (Prisoner Race
Mine Modifier / 100) * Labor Mines * 5
Magik
2008-06-04 05:21:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Phaidros
Well, one factor is missing for sure: the amount of unmined minerals.
ExtractedMetal = UnminedMinerals * (Density / 100) * (Prisoner Race
Mine Modifier / 100) * Labor Mines * 5
This is over-simplifying the process, but ok:

ExtractedMetal = (Density / 100) * (Prisoner Race Mine Modifier / 100)
* Labor Mines * 5
If ExtractedMetal > UnminedMinerals Then ExtractedMetal =
UnminedMinerals

The best mining race prisoners are used first until the number of
prisoners used meets the capacity of the buildings that you have. For
example, we say that you have 10k Lizards, 100k Solorian prisoners,
and 90 labor mines. The Lizards will be used in the mines first up to
the 9k lizard prisoners that would fill the capacity of the 90 labor
mines and the rest are skipped.

Standard mineral mines use the following formula (and condition):

ExtractedMetal = (Density / 100) * (Race Mine Modifier / 100) * Mines
* 10 * Bonus
If ExtractedMetal > UnminedMinerals Then ExtractedMetal =
UnminedMinerals

Bonus here is a base of 1 for all standard races, .125 for RCS using
Arerran Capital, 3 for RCS using Xelovi Hive. The bonus increases by
1 if RCS has 50k insectoids, and for any race having 50k reptilians.

And note that standard mineral mines have a diminishing return over
100 mines by any mines that exceed 100 only count for their square
root in number. Labor mines don't have diminishing return.

Magik
Phaidros
2008-06-04 06:28:26 UTC
Permalink
Ok, thanks a lot. Now we a good common base to discuss what's going
on.

I have a base with a small population of Privateer prisoners, enough
to fill 10 labor mines and 10 labor factories.

The Base log says:
Labor camps have generated 2 supplies and 30 mc.
Labor mines produced 19 kt of metals and 57 mc.

Planet data are the following (they are from the end of the turn, so
do reflect exactly the situation when the labor mine code jumps in,
but with that small number of labor mines they should be good enough):

N 2897 65%
D 1962 33%
T 2015 32%
M 376 26%

The first column gives the amount of unmined minerals, the second
column the density.

If I enter these numbers into the labor mine function with the mining
stat of the Privateers of 25 and the density taken as percentage (eg.
0.65) the result is:

ExtractedMetal:
N 3.62
D 2.45
T 2.52
M 0.47

Depending on how rounding is done this should result in either 7 or 9
kt of minerals mined. So interestingly enough the program gives me a
quite a bonus in that case.

I have another small base with a few Privateer prisoners, just enough
to fill 1 labor mine and 1 labor factory.

The base log says:
Labor camps have generated 0 supplies and 3 mc.
Labor mines produced 3 kt of metals and 6 mc.

The planet data for that one are:
N 39412 62%
D 1855 40%
T 696 19%
M 1108 42%

Calculating according to the same procedure the extracted metal should
consist of 4.93 units of Neutronium. However, that's again not what
the base log says. And this time a double penalty is served. The
amount of metals is lower and you get only 2 mc per metal.

Q1: What's going on here?

Q2: How does the function deal with labor mines and labor factories
that are only partly filled. Are they completely ignored or to the
enter the calculation as partly filled?

Phaidros
Black No.1
2008-06-14 22:55:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Phaidros
Ok, thanks a lot. Now we a good common base to discuss what's going
on.
I have a base with a small population of Privateer prisoners, enough
to fill 10 labor mines and 10 labor factories.
Labor camps have generated 2 supplies and 30 mc.
Labor mines produced 19 kt of metals and 57 mc.
[...]
Post by Phaidros
N 2897 65%
D 1962 33%
T 2015 32%
M 376 26%
The first column gives the amount of unmined minerals, the second
column the density.
If I enter these numbers into the labor mine function with the mining
stat of the Privateers of 25 and the density taken as percentage (eg.
N 3.62
D 2.45
T 2.52
M 0.47
Using the formula provided by Magik:

ExtractedMetal = (Density / 100) * (Prisoner Race Mine Modifier / 100) * Labor
Mines * 5
If ExtractedMetal > UnminedMinerals Then ExtractedMetal = UnminedMinerals

In your case we have:

(Prisoner Race Mine Modifier / 100) * Labor Mines * 5
= 0.25 * 10 * 5 = 12,5

Using your densities from above we get:

N: 0.65 * 12,5 = 8,125
D 0.33 * 12,5 = 4,125
T 0.32 * 12,5 = 4
M: 0.26 * 12,5 = 3,25

-> 19kt (like your log stated)

Cheers,
Jochen
Phaidros
2008-06-16 14:26:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Black No.1
Post by Phaidros
Ok, thanks a lot. Now we a good common base to discuss what's going
on.
I have a base with a small population of Privateer prisoners, enough
to fill 10 labor mines and 10 labor factories.
Labor camps have generated 2 supplies and 30 mc.
Labor mines produced 19 kt of metals and 57 mc.
[...]
Post by Phaidros
N 2897 65%
D 1962 33%
T 2015 32%
M 376 26%
The first column gives the amount of unmined minerals, the second
column the density.
If I enter these numbers into the labor mine function with the mining
stat of the Privateers of 25 and the density taken as percentage (eg.
N 3.62
D 2.45
T 2.52
M 0.47
ExtractedMetal = (Density / 100) * (Prisoner Race Mine Modifier / 100) * Labor
Mines * 5
If ExtractedMetal > UnminedMinerals Then ExtractedMetal = UnminedMinerals
(Prisoner Race Mine Modifier / 100) * Labor Mines * 5
= 0.25 * 10 * 5 = 12,5
N: 0.65 * 12,5 = 8,125
D 0.33 * 12,5 = 4,125
T 0.32 * 12,5 = 4
M: 0.26 * 12,5 = 3,25
-> 19kt (like your log stated)
Cheers,
Jochen
Yeah, I got it. The new race modifier really hurts if you go after the
Privateers. They are scum and lazy.

Phaidros
Black No.1
2008-06-17 09:48:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by Phaidros
Yeah, I got it. The new race modifier really hurts if you go after the
Privateers. They are scum and lazy.
Phaidros
Just bomb them away and get the goodies... ;)

Cheers,
Jochen

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